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<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>That would be $110.72 per hour. I bet some of those costs are in
fact fixed costs (paid whether or not the plane leaves the ground) such as
insurance and annual inspection. I’d be interested to see a line item
breakdown and split that number into fixed costs vs. hourly costs. Would your
friend be willing to share his logs or perhaps even group his costs into
specific categories (fuel, annual, insurance, etc)? That would probably be a
good sanity check and might point out something we may have otherwise missed.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>Thanks,<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>-Steve<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'><o:p> </o:p></span></p>
<div>
<div style='border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in'>
<p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>From:</span></b><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>
williammccann@comcast.net [mailto:williammccann@comcast.net] <br>
<b>Sent:</b> Tuesday, April 07, 2009 7:57 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> Steve Gordon<br>
<b>Cc:</b> eefc-core@workingcode.com<br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: Agenda for Wed evening<o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=MsoNormal><o:p> </o:p></p>
<div>
<p><span style='font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>Steve - I asked a
friend who owns a C172M based at Klwm , who keeps a log of actual
time,fuel ,repairs, insurance,and anything associated with the plane
,what the cost to operate the plane for the year 2008 . His total cost for
112 hrs were $12,400.00 .These are operating costs only. Maybe we can use these
numbers for comparison.<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p><span style='font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p><span style='font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>Bill Mc<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";
color:black'><br>
----- Original Message -----<br>
From: "Steve Gordon" <steve@media-phile.com><br>
To: eefc-core@workingcode.com<br>
Sent: Tuesday, April 7, 2009 6:27:30 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern<br>
Subject: RE: Agenda for Wed evening<o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>I made some alterations to the spreadsheet and sent it to
Mike. Since Mike owns the spreadsheet I wanted to give him a chance to
review it before I sent it to the rest of the group.</span><span
style='color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>The changes I made were to the 2<sup>nd</sup> worksheet: Buy a
plane. Rather than have two different sections, one with and one without
financing, I added a “% Down” field that is editable so we can vary the amount
financed. I consolidated the outputs into “One Time cost, Monthly Dues,
and Rate Per Hour” as I think those are the three key costs that all members
will need to understand. I also locked down the spreadsheet so only those
fields that are meant to be edited are editable. I think that will help
avoid confusion if/when we send this out to the others.</span><span
style='color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>I’ve attached the updated spreadsheet with my changes.
Constructive criticism is always welcomed.</span><span style='color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>Thanks,</span><span style='color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>-Steve</span><span style='color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<div>
<div style='border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in'>
<p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";
color:black'>From:</span></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";
color:black'> eefc-core-bounces@workingcode.com
[mailto:eefc-core-bounces@workingcode.com] <b>On Behalf Of </b>Bob Irving<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Tuesday, April 07, 2009 5:42 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> mike.lysik@comcast.net; eefc-core@workingcode.com<br>
<b>Subject:</b> RE: Agenda for Wed evening</span><span style='color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";
color:#1F497D'>I can bring a laptop with the spreadsheet. I only know of one
version of the spreadsheet – the original. Is there a new version?</span><span
style='color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<div>
<div style='border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in'>
<p class=MsoNormal><b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";
color:black'>From:</span></b><span style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";
color:black'> eefc-core-bounces@workingcode.com
[mailto:eefc-core-bounces@workingcode.com] <b>On Behalf Of </b>mike.lysik@comcast.net<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Tuesday, April 07, 2009 5:29 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> eefc-core@workingcode.com<br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: Agenda for Wed evening</span><span style='color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=MsoNormal><span style='color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<div>
<p><span style='font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>Liability
insurance is a good topic, and a lawyer should be consulted. Maybe
someone knows a lawyer that would offer to help. A friend at work
belonged to a flying club/group at one time, and they had a policy on the
plane(in the situation where it damaged something or someone), and then each
member had his/her own add-on policy if they wanted or needed extra
coverage. The extra coverage was on their own dime.</span><span
style='color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p><span style='color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p><span style='font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>For tomorrow night...I
think that if we each bring any necessary fixed or variable costs that we
don't yet have, and then work them into the spreadsheet, we'll have a pretty
good understanding of what it will cost to run the club. Then we can
start communicating with the others that are interested. Buying vs.
leasing from Eagle could also be brought to the entire group while we show the
pro's and con's of each.</span><span style='color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p><span style='color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p><span style='font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>I may not be able
to make it tomorrow night, would someone be able to bring the spreadsheet
with Steve's updates, maybe on a laptop so you can make changes on the fly?</span><span
style='color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p><span style='color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p><span style='font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>It may be too
early, but I'm a little hesitant on the Eagle deal because the club doesn't end
up owning the plane after paying Eagle's note.</span><span style='color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p><span style='color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";
color:black'>Mike<br>
----- Original Message -----<br>
From: williammccann@comcast.net<br>
To: "Bob Irving" <rhirving@verizon.net><br>
Cc: eefc-core@workingcode.com<br>
Sent: Tuesday, April 7, 2009 5:01:40 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern<br>
Subject: Re: Agenda for Wed evening</span><span style='color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<div>
<div>
<p><span style='font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>Bob - I did a
little research on the Garmin 430W GPS, /nav/com with Glideslope and moving
map.Pricing is about $8,100.00 and around $2000 to install. The cost for an
annual is more like $ 2200.00 , so maybe we can hold Eagle @ the
$1500 estimate.Purchase options and length of lease are addressed .Can you
ask Tim if the current lien-holder allows sub - leasing of their
aircraft. Also, is the pilots liability insurance included in
the $4500.00 fixed cost or should the individual be responsible to
carry additional renters insurance. Does anybody have any
objections to a $ 250.00 initiation fee and a returnable $ 250.00 security
deposit required when joining the club.</span><span style='color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p><span style='color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p><span style='font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>Thanks</span><span
style='color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p><span style='font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>Bill McCann</span><span
style='color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";
color:black'><br>
----- Original Message -----<br>
From: "Bob Irving" <rhirving@verizon.net><br>
To: toddmbs@yahoo.com, williammccann@comcast.net, "mike lysik"
<mike.lysik@comcast.net><br>
Cc: eefc-core@workingcode.com<br>
Sent: Tuesday, April 7, 2009 1:57:48 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern<br>
Subject: RE: Agenda for Wed evening</span><span style='color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Todd
– I agree that “there is owed more on it than it is worth.” So – I have
asked Sean to get Tim to specify the deal and I have asked them if they would
be willing to do an avionics upgrade, a fresh annual and an IFR certification –
all before we take over. I’ve also asked for a specific residual number
or buyout fee once the note is paid off. 976 may not make sense
financially when compared to the option of buying something. But buying
something presents a whole new set of issues. </span><span
style='color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Tim
is out of town but Sean promises to get back to me. We’ll see. </span><span
style='color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Bob</span><span
style='color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<div style='border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in'>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><b><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";color:black'>From:</span></b><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif";color:black'>
toddmbs@yahoo.com [mailto:toddmbs@yahoo.com] <br>
<b>Sent:</b> Tuesday, April 07, 2009 1:11 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> williammccann@comcast.net; 'mike lysik'; Bob Irving<br>
<b>Cc:</b> eefc-core@workingcode.com<br>
<b>Subject:</b> RE: Agenda for Wed evening</span><span style='color:black'><o:p></o:p></span></p>
</div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='color:black'> <o:p></o:p></span></p>
<table class=MsoNormalTable border=0 cellspacing=0 cellpadding=0>
<tr>
<td valign=top style='padding:0in 0in 0in 0in'>
<div id=yiv11814067>
<div id=yiv1980941400>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'>Gentlmen,<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'>I
have to say that this may the fastest combined effort that I've
seen on anything in a long time. This is great, I like what I'm
seeing.<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'> <o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'>I
would say that having an agenda is definitely needed at some point.
We should probably develop a time line and goals to expect.
Things will be defined the further we get obviously. At the minimum,
what we have right now for certain is 7 pilots hho want an airplane to fly as
much as possible at a reasonable cost. <o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'> <o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'>Mike,
good spreadsheet. Those numbers are closer to what I was expecting.
Going under my philosophy of "assumptions x 2" the cost would
still be within my expectations.<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'> <o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'>Bob, we
need to get Tim to give us what his
exact plan is with 976. I'm sure he wants to make
money on it because it's only costing them at this point, and I'm
guessing that there is owed more on than it is worth. It is the path of
least resistence, however, a 15 year mortgage on a $50k plane that is ready
to go will cost less per month than basically leasing 976 at $650/mo (if that
is the option here).<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'> <o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'>I'll
bring my financial calculator tommorrow, any material I can find about
setting up by-laws, etc, and a sample flyer that we can post.<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'> <o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'>Jim,
I don't know how you have this network set up. Am I double sending these
e-mails?<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'> <o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'>Todd<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'> <o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><br>
--- On <b>Mon, 4/6/09, Bob Irving <i><rhirving@verizon.net></i></b>
wrote:<o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<blockquote style='border:none;border-left:solid #1010FF 1.5pt;padding:0in 0in 0in 4.0pt;
margin-left:3.75pt;margin-top:5.0pt;margin-bottom:5.0pt'>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;margin-bottom:12.0pt'><br>
From: Bob Irving <rhirving@verizon.net><br>
Subject: RE: Agenda for Wed evening<br>
To: williammccann@comcast.net, "'mike lysik'"
<mike.lysik@comcast.net><br>
Cc: eefc-core@workingcode.com<br>
Date: Monday, April 6, 2009, 3:19 PM<o:p></o:p></p>
<div id=yiv1138060819>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>I’m
in the process of trying to do that but Tim is out of town until tomorrow. I
will catch up with him before the meeting and get answers.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
</blockquote>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'> <o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:#1F497D'>Bob</span>
<o:p></o:p></p>
<div>
<div style='border:none;border-top:solid #B5C4DF 1.0pt;padding:3.0pt 0in 0in 0in'>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><b><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>From:</span></b><span
style='font-size:10.0pt;font-family:"Tahoma","sans-serif"'>
eefc-core-bounces@workingcode.com [mailto:eefc-core-bounces@workingcode.com] <b>On
Behalf Of </b>williammccann@comcast.net<br>
<b>Sent:</b> Monday, April 06, 2009 3:14 PM<br>
<b>To:</b> mike lysik<br>
<b>Cc:</b> eefc-core@workingcode.com<br>
<b>Subject:</b> Re: Agenda for Wed evening</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
</div>
<div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>I'm in agreement with
Mike , we should treat this as a pilot program with six people. The price
that Eagle East is asking , and all of the upgrades</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>needed , will determine
( speaking for myself ) if I would be interested. If you are looking to add
on an Instrument Rating in the future , or just for situational awareness ,
976 needs a new avionics package.Why not negotiate a firm
price with Tim so we no where to start with the numbers . </span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'> <o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>Thanks,</span><o:p></o:p></p>
</div>
<div>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>Bill McCann</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'> <o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'> <o:p></o:p></p>
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<p style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";
color:black'><br>
----- Original Message -----<br>
From: "mike lysik" <mike.lysik@comcast.net><br>
To: "Bob Irving" <rhirving@verizon.net><br>
Cc: eefc-core@workingcode.com<br>
Sent: Monday, April 6, 2009 2:21:51 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern<br>
Subject: Re: Agenda for Wed evening</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>I like the thought
of having an agenda, but some of the items may be premature. Maybe we
keep the hit list short and just determine if the total cost
of doing this is acceptable with the six of us, and if so, agree on our next
steps.</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'> <o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'>Thanks</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p style='margin-bottom:12.0pt'><span style='font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";
color:black'>Mike <br>
----- Original Message -----<br>
From: "Bob Irving" <rhirving@verizon.net><br>
To: eefc-core@workingcode.com<br>
Sent: Monday, April 6, 2009 1:22:25 PM GMT -05:00 US/Canada Eastern<br>
Subject: Agenda for Wed evening</span><o:p></o:p></p>
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<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-size:11.0pt;font-family:"Calibri","sans-serif";color:black'>Attached
is a proposed agenda. Do we need to add anything?</span> <o:p></o:p></p>
<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
style='font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'><br>
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style='font-family:"Arial","sans-serif";color:black'><br>
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<p class=MsoNormal style='mso-margin-top-alt:auto;mso-margin-bottom-alt:auto'><span
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