<!DOCTYPE HTML PUBLIC "-//W3C//DTD HTML 4.0 Transitional//EN">
<HTML><HEAD>
<META http-equiv=Content-Type content="text/html; charset=iso-8859-1">
<META content="MSHTML 6.00.6000.16809" name=GENERATOR>
<STYLE></STYLE>
</HEAD>
<BODY bgColor=#ffffff>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Bob</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Can you ask Tim if he would go for item-6 on Todd's
list below? Example: If we go with 976 for $18k, + $10k for
430W(installed) + some $ for xponder(does this come with the 430W?) + some
money for whatever general upgrades the cockpit and panel need(do the VOR's
work? one may be broken) + $20k for engine + anything else =
total cost of plane to be financed by our group, guranteed by Eagle
East.</FONT></DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2></FONT> </DIV>
<DIV><FONT face=Arial size=2>Mike</FONT></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE
style="PADDING-RIGHT: 0px; PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: #000000 2px solid; MARGIN-RIGHT: 0px">
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial">----- Original Message ----- </DIV>
<DIV
style="BACKGROUND: #e4e4e4; FONT: 10pt arial; font-color: black"><B>From:</B>
<A title=toddmbs@yahoo.com href="mailto:toddmbs@yahoo.com">Todd Brooks</A>
</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>To:</B> <A title=eefc-core@workingcode.com
href="mailto:eefc-core@workingcode.com">Eagle East Flying Club Core Team</A>
</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Sent:</B> Saturday, April 11, 2009 4:19
PM</DIV>
<DIV style="FONT: 10pt arial"><B>Subject:</B> RE: sample numbers</DIV>
<DIV><BR></DIV>
<TABLE cellSpacing=0 cellPadding=0 border=0>
<TBODY>
<TR>
<TD vAlign=top>
<DIV>Nice work guys. I need to wake earlier I guess!</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>After reading the slew of emails, I have a few thoughts:</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>1. The survey let me complete it without answering it and then I
couldn't go back.</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>2. If we finance a plane for 10 years it actually comes
out to very little $ per member with regards to the plane itself.
It's the other fixed costs that really add up. </DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>3. I think the number of members will only slightly affect the
monthly dues. Here is why I say this: if we only have 10 members
the likelihood of us buying another plane is slim; so we will only
have to cover our costs to a minimum and contribute to the savings
account with a reasonable amount. However if we have 20 members then we
will want to buy another plane and if the dues are the same then that
extra money will go into the savings for another plane. Does that
make sense?</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>4. I say finance as much as possible. </DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>5. The initial down-payment could be structured to where a member
gets vested after so much of a time period. This will
first lock in a member so they don't just leave after a month and we're
stuck with less cash. It also gives some of our money back after
we're up and flying. For example (making up numbers here): if we
take $1000 upfront per member, half of that can be returned in 6 months
if they leave and 3/4 can returned in 12 months if they leave.
Then after a year we can take a vote and decide what we do with the
down-payment; return some of it, all of it or use it towards
another plane for example. (Just a thought)</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>6. Going back to 976, I'm missing a gap somewhere in this financing
scheme. Why would we have to pony up $18,000? That would
leave only a $25,000 (roughly) loan. Why can't we refinance the
whole thing at $40k-ish and give Tim is money. Then we only have to come
up with $4,000 ($267 / 15 member). And can't we finance it after
the plane gets outfitted with new avs? Hence, finance the Garmin.</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>7. I like the spreadsheet. The totals in green appear to be
bare minimum cost for 12 members. Assuming that, we will have to
round these numbers up to whatever reasonable amount can include a slush
fund/saving account.</DIV>
<DIV> </DIV>
<DIV>Todd</DIV>
<DIV><BR><BR>--- On <B>Sat, 4/11/09, Steve Gordon
<I><steve@media-phile.com></I></B> wrote:<BR></DIV>
<BLOCKQUOTE
style="PADDING-LEFT: 5px; MARGIN-LEFT: 5px; BORDER-LEFT: rgb(16,16,255) 2px solid"><BR>From:
Steve Gordon <steve@media-phile.com><BR>Subject: RE: sample
numbers<BR>To: "Eagle East Flying Club Core Team"
<eefc-core@workingcode.com><BR>Date: Saturday, April 11, 2009,
1:49 PM<BR><BR>
<DIV class=plainMail>I see your point. If we can roll in these
seemingly up front costs into the loan it might be more fair to all
members regardless of when they join or leave, and it's less of a
burden to the founding members. This is assuming the bank would
allow us to finance things such as an initial overhaul fund.<BR><BR>I
intentionally left the cost of a GPS NAV/COM out of the base costs to
keep the options simple. I asked a followup question in the survey
asking if members would be willing to spend approx $500 - $1,000
towards that equipment. However, if that cost is rolled into the
loan, we would need to communicate a monthly dues increase. I
can change the wording of the folowup question to reflect what the
monthly increase would be.<BR><BR>Sent from Windows Mobile
Smartphone.<BR><BR>-----Original Message-----<BR>From: James Carlson
<<A
href="http://us.mc1113.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=carlsonj@workingcode.com"
ymailto="mailto:carlsonj@workingcode.com">carlsonj@workingcode.com</A>><BR>Sent:
Saturday, April 11, 2009 1:25 PM<BR>To: <A
href="http://us.mc1113.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=eefc-core@workingcode.com"
ymailto="mailto:eefc-core@workingcode.com">eefc-core@workingcode.com</A><BR>Subject:
RE: sample numbers<BR><BR>Steve Gordon writes:<BR>> The one-time
cost is a hard number to nail down because it depends very
much<BR>> on the particular aircraft we choose. It just
happens that given the<BR>> particular aircraft chosen as samples,
the 172 has a higher one-time cost<BR>> than the Cardinal.
Since these are not necessarily the actual aircraft we<BR>> will
pursue, I thought we should give a range as we will not know the
actual<BR>> cost until we settle on something. <BR><BR>Yep; the new
spreadsheet does look pretty good. The SMOH handling
was<BR>confusing at first until I figured out that you were
recapturing the<BR>lost asset value from the members so that we'd have
an adequate<BR>initial fund for repair later.<BR><BR>These numbers
don't seem to include the avionics we've been talking<BR>about, or at
least it's unclear to me if they do (and they're just<BR>rolled into
the overall purchase). The extra $10K up front for a
430W<BR>would need to go in somewhere, and it needn't necessarily go
in the<BR>one-time cost. It could be financed. (I think
we're probably better<BR>off keeping as many things out of the
one-time cost as we can, and<BR>borrowing more instead. The
monthly cost doesn't get returned to<BR>those who leave the club, but
at least part of the one-time cost might<BR>need to be.)<BR><BR>If
someone is in the club for (say) a year, I think it's
completely<BR>fair that he pays his share for the financed fixed costs
paid during<BR>that year, but it's probably not fair to charge him for
the whole cost<BR>of the extras -- amount down, SMOH, or 430W.
He didn't use those<BR>things up.<BR><BR>Consider: suppose we just put
the entire plane into the one-time cost.<BR>Those leaving would
logically get their portion of the plane back;<BR>we'd buy up their
share. Now suppose we finance everything. Those<BR>leaving
would get nothing back, because they paid as they went.
This<BR>argues to me that it's in the club's interest (and also fair)
to make<BR>sure as much goes to the monthly dues as we can.<BR><BR>In
any event, none of the numbers are outrageous, so it feels
like<BR>we're in the right area.<BR><BR>-- <BR>James Carlson
42.703N 71.076W
<<A
href="http://us.mc1113.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=carlsonj@workingcode.com"
ymailto="mailto:carlsonj@workingcode.com">carlsonj@workingcode.com</A>><BR>_______________________________________________<BR>eefc-core
mailing list<BR><A
href="http://us.mc1113.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=eefc-core@workingcode.com"
ymailto="mailto:eefc-core@workingcode.com">eefc-core@workingcode..com</A><BR><A
href="https://www.workingcode.com/mailman/listinfo/eefc-core"
target=_blank>https://www.workingcode.com/mailman/listinfo/eefc-core</A><BR><BR>_______________________________________________<BR>eefc-core
mailing list<BR><A
href="http://us.mc1113.mail.yahoo.com/mc/compose?to=eefc-core@workingcode.com"
ymailto="mailto:eefc-core@workingcode.com">eefc-core@workingcode.com</A><BR><A
href="https://www.workingcode.com/mailman/listinfo/eefc-core"
target=_blank>https://www.workingcode.com/mailman/listinfo/eefc-core</A><BR></DIV></BLOCKQUOTE></TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE><BR>
<P>
<HR>
<P></P>_______________________________________________<BR>eefc-core mailing
list<BR>eefc-core@workingcode.com<BR>https://www.workingcode.com/mailman/listinfo/eefc-core<BR></BLOCKQUOTE></BODY></HTML>